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  • A65-8 oil temperature question?

  • Technical Chat Tips and Advice, including flying the Luscombe
Technical Chat Tips and Advice, including flying the Luscombe

Moderator: HTB

 #8207  by Rob
 Sat Nov 09, 2013 7:50 pm
Hello to you all. My name is Robert den Hartog and I am the new keeper of N25366 a 1940 Luscombe 8A (#1242) just arrived in the Netherlands. I recently flew her from Phoenix AZ (Chandler/ Doug Combs) to Lakeland FL and then she was containerised and shipped to Rotterdam. (A travel report + youtube video soon to follow.) During the trip in the US the oil temperature was about 60F over ambient.
Over here I reach about 55F over ambient. The engine has approx. 30 hours SMOH. She has the Airwolf oil filter STC. I know a Continental A65s runs cold. However, a low temp. means that not enough moisture is boiled away and acids can form.
Measures I have already taken are: permanently installing the winterisation plate; changing the oil every 25 hours to reduce the acids although the Airwolf STC allows 50 hours or 12 months for the oil change; adding Camguard to the oil. Down the road are: insulating the kidney tank (WagAero sells insulating covers for 50$); insulating the oil hoses to/from the oil filter with fire sleeves. Some have suggested heating the oil at ten hour intervals in a cooker to rid the moisture.

Temperature in the oil tank (verified with a digital probe) is about 140 - 150 F. Measurement before the oil enters the engine like said is about 55F over ambient. I burn slightly to much fuel for which an overhaul of the carb has been ordered (the inside stack are light brown).

Any experiences or suggestions out there?

Kind regards,

Rob den Hartog
N25366

(BTW: Tried to upload pictures but was unable.)
 #8210  by Pete Bush
 Sun Nov 10, 2013 7:10 pm
Hi Robert,

Great to hear of a new Luscombe in Europe and welcome to the site.

Low oil temps are not unusual on the small Continental engines mounted in Luscombes, I would say your 65C oil with an ambient of around 12c is fairly typical. It would seem like you are already on top of it, a lot of owners here in the UK fit a plate over the large opening in the cowling for the winter months, it does make a difference. I guess insulating your filter and hoses is another good idea. I change oil every 25 hours and the filter at 50.

What carburettor do you have fitted, Stromburg or Marvel Schebler.

Let us know when you get some photos on the internet so we can all admire your new steed.

Regards
Pete (G-BROO)

PS I wouldn’t block the slot in the upper cowling as that keeps the generator (8E & F), and more importantly the magnetos cool.
 #8212  by Nige
 Mon Nov 11, 2013 1:23 pm
Hi Robert and my own personal welcome to the European Luscombe site. Congratulations to you on your new lovely Luscombe 8A.

As usual, Pete's spot on with his advice and I've learnt something new with the idea of insulating the oil filter and hoses. Hmmm, I'll look into that! :shock: if, like myself, you are fortunate to have electricity nearby and good protection over the Winter, then you may consider placing, safely, heater tubes (aka light bulbs?) inside the cowling. I use two 60 Watt Greenhouse tube heaters, which you can just hold onto for a second or two, proving they are not dangerously hot and maintain an internal cowling temp of around 25C. (I also have 4 old blankets over the cowling and foam inserts over the upper cooling grills with covers over the prop. This where a LOT of heat is traded and lost) I do this before the oil cools down after flying my 8E. Also, it reduces, I believe, the initial wear and tear on start up, with the temp gauge already showing movement. This may also (probably) improve latent heat in the engine providing a a stronger source for carb heat, should you be in a hurry to get airborne - less time to warm. Obviously, the engine will settle back to it's 'normal' running temp when airborne but every little bit helps before/after take off of course! :wink: I also place two 60 Watt heaters in the cabin, radiating heat through the instruments/radio and into the overhead main spars and a little way down the wings. You probably think I fuss too much but I'm convinced this all helps in potentially damp cold conditions. The face plate is, as Pete and others say, an excellent idea. I hope these tips may be of help.

Good luck and have fun! :lol:

Nige.
 #8218  by Rob
 Fri Nov 15, 2013 8:52 pm
Pete,

what exactly do you mean by "fit a plate over the large opening in the cowling"? Do you mean the cooling intakes left and right with the anti-bird grids OR the hole above the air filter box? If you mean the latter I have already professionally closed it with duct tape...

I have the Stromburg carb without mixture control. As I suspected it had been tampered with I got a new one from Uni-tech (Bob Kachergius) which will arrive here on Monday. Costs a *** load but given the fuel prices I will recoupe in about a hundred hours. It should burn leaner and thus bring the temp slighty up.

BR

Rob
 #8219  by Rob
 Fri Nov 15, 2013 9:03 pm
Regarding pictures: I am unable to upload any picutre. Either as an attachment or in the gallery. Only get error reports.
 #8226  by Rob
 Sat Nov 16, 2013 9:37 pm
Unfortunately already have that one blocked. Will implement the other measures first and look and see. It is a good idea to pre heat like Nigel. Described. Will do that to. Spent part of the afternoon working on repairing paint chips.

BR

Rob
 #8227  by Stuart Jones
 Sat Nov 16, 2013 10:06 pm
Does every one else have a vent in the front cowl for carb air ? Why not take the carb air heat from inside the cowl, surely it would be warmer to start with than 100 mph forced cold air from the front ?
 #8229  by Nige
 Mon Nov 18, 2013 9:15 pm
You need the ram air effect Rob. :wink:

Nige.
 #8383  by Rob
 Wed Feb 05, 2014 2:28 pm
Nige wrote:Hi Robert and my own personal welcome to the European Luscombe site. Congratulations to you on your new lovely Luscombe 8A.

I use two 60 Watt Greenhouse tube heaters, which you can just hold onto for a second or two, proving they are not dangerously hot and maintain an internal cowling temp of around 25C. (I also have 4 old blankets over the cowling and foam inserts over the upper cooling grills with covers over the prop. This where a LOT of heat is traded and lost) I do this before the oil cools down after flying my 8E. Also, it reduces, I believe, the initial wear and tear on start up, with the temp gauge already showing movement. This may also (probably) improve latent heat in the engine providing a a stronger source for carb heat, should you be in a hurry to get airborne - less time to warm. Obviously, the engine will settle back to it's 'normal' running temp when airborne but every little bit helps before/after take off of course! :wink: I also place two 60 Watt heaters in the cabin, radiating heat through the instruments/radio and into the overhead main spars and a little way down the wings. You probably think I fuss too much but I'm convinced this all helps in potentially damp cold conditions. The face plate is, as Pete and others say, an excellent idea. I hope these tips may be of help.

Good luck and have fun! :lol:

Nige.


NIge,

I have bought the heater tubes. Do you leave them on 24/7? Have you built anything like a grid around them? I am thinking of mounting them on a piece of board and putting brid grid over them to prevent stuff catching fire. Aren't you worried by fire hazards.

Do you have pics of your setup?

Thanks,

Rob
 #8384  by Nige
 Thu Feb 06, 2014 6:24 pm
Hi Rob,

The heathers, although hot to the touch, are not sufficiently hot enough to set fire to paper as far as I've experimented with. The wiring is completely secured internally. Based on that principle I've placed the heaters on the carpet in the cabin, so not touching anything as they are on supports. In the cowling, they are placed alongside the exhausts, which, along with other items, get a lot hotter than these greenhouse heaters.

If in doubt, Rob, place these items in such a way as you feel comfortable. Mine have been used in this way for many years and I'm sure they benefit the Luscombe hugely.

Nige.
 #8386  by Rob
 Thu Feb 06, 2014 8:20 pm
Thanks Nige. Do you have them on 24/7?
 #8387  by Nige
 Fri Feb 07, 2014 6:48 pm
Ah, yes, sorry Rob. I do indeed.

Nige. Ps give me a call when after I'm home from the sim at Manchester after tomorrow if you like? 07968 980624. :lol: